Fastball

[Shooter]

I have made this reference before, "Spahn and Sain and pray for rain".  For you young'uns it refers to Boston's Warren Spahn and Johnny Sain, and the fact that they didn't have a legitimate number three for a three man pitching rotation.  Great pitchers were a different breed back then.  That is not saying that they were better than today's pitchers, but that the great ones of earlier eras would be great today.  I am not going to do the research, but my sense is that they started more games and pitched longer into games than pitchers are expected today.

This is an undeniable fact, which is the main reason I doubt those guys sustained velocity into the mid 90s while doing so. I do not believe it possible for a human being to pitch 300 innings while sitting at 95+. That's not to say they weren't good, the great pitchers back then had great walk rates and had good pitch mixes and threw more breaking stuff, etc. I just can't buy that your average fastball in the 1930s wasn't at least 4-5 mph slower than the average fastball today, when the average fastball right now is a good 1-2 mph faster than it was as recently as 2008.

Nobody ever claimed these guys were sitting at 95. In fact, I think a lot of them took pride in "pitching smart" -- not exerting themselves particularly hard against the dregs of the lineup. And in many of the eras past, there were a lot of dead spots in the lineup.

I'm not saying they threw harder than Aroldis Chapman, but I wouldn't be shocked if they could get pretty close for one pitch.

[Tonker]

I have made this reference before, "Spahn and Sain and pray for rain".  For you young'uns it refers to Boston's Warren Spahn and Johnny Sain, and the fact that they didn't have a legitimate number three for a three man pitching rotation.  Great pitchers were a different breed back then.  That is not saying that they were better than today's pitchers, but that the great ones of earlier eras would be great today.  I am not going to do the research, but my sense is that they started more games and pitched longer into games than pitchers are expected today.

This is an undeniable fact, which is the main reason I doubt those guys sustained velocity into the mid 90s while doing so. I do not believe it possible for a human being to pitch 300 innings while sitting at 95+. That's not to say they weren't good, the great pitchers back then had great walk rates and had good pitch mixes and threw more breaking stuff, etc. I just can't buy that your average fastball in the 1930s wasn't at least 4-5 mph slower than the average fastball today, when the average fastball right now is a good 1-2 mph faster than it was as recently as 2008.

Nobody ever claimed these guys were sitting at 95. In fact, I think a lot of them took pride in "pitching smart" -- not exerting themselves particularly hard against the dregs of the lineup. And in many of the eras past, there were a lot of dead spots in the lineup.

I'm not saying they threw harder than Aroldis Chapman, but I wouldn't be shocked if they could get pretty close for one pitch.

Aw, man.  We don't have to guess, they figured it out!  Right: spoiler alert...


Both Feller and Ryan were faster than Chapman, at around 107 and 108 respectively.

[Yeti]

I have made this reference before, "Spahn and Sain and pray for rain".  For you young'uns it refers to Boston's Warren Spahn and Johnny Sain, and the fact that they didn't have a legitimate number three for a three man pitching rotation.  Great pitchers were a different breed back then.  That is not saying that they were better than today's pitchers, but that the great ones of earlier eras would be great today.  I am not going to do the research, but my sense is that they started more games and pitched longer into games than pitchers are expected today.

This is an undeniable fact, which is the main reason I doubt those guys sustained velocity into the mid 90s while doing so. I do not believe it possible for a human being to pitch 300 innings while sitting at 95+. That's not to say they weren't good, the great pitchers back then had great walk rates and had good pitch mixes and threw more breaking stuff, etc. I just can't buy that your average fastball in the 1930s wasn't at least 4-5 mph slower than the average fastball today, when the average fastball right now is a good 1-2 mph faster than it was as recently as 2008.

Watch the film.  When you see who the fastest pitcher ever is, your jaw will drop!

I'm getting closer to Yeti:Fastball::Pank:Die Hard each time you write that.

[ChuckD]

I have made this reference before, "Spahn and Sain and pray for rain".  For you young'uns it refers to Boston's Warren Spahn and Johnny Sain, and the fact that they didn't have a legitimate number three for a three man pitching rotation.  Great pitchers were a different breed back then.  That is not saying that they were better than today's pitchers, but that the great ones of earlier eras would be great today.  I am not going to do the research, but my sense is that they started more games and pitched longer into games than pitchers are expected today.

This is an undeniable fact, which is the main reason I doubt those guys sustained velocity into the mid 90s while doing so. I do not believe it possible for a human being to pitch 300 innings while sitting at 95+. That's not to say they weren't good, the great pitchers back then had great walk rates and had good pitch mixes and threw more breaking stuff, etc. I just can't buy that your average fastball in the 1930s wasn't at least 4-5 mph slower than the average fastball today, when the average fastball right now is a good 1-2 mph faster than it was as recently as 2008.

Watch the film.  When you see who the fastest pitcher ever is, your jaw will drop!

I'm getting closer to Yeti:Fastball::Pank:Die Hard each time you write that.

McClane kills Gruber.

Nolan Ryan -- 108.5 mph.

[Tonker]

I have made this reference before, "Spahn and Sain and pray for rain".  For you young'uns it refers to Boston's Warren Spahn and Johnny Sain, and the fact that they didn't have a legitimate number three for a three man pitching rotation.  Great pitchers were a different breed back then.  That is not saying that they were better than today's pitchers, but that the great ones of earlier eras would be great today.  I am not going to do the research, but my sense is that they started more games and pitched longer into games than pitchers are expected today.

This is an undeniable fact, which is the main reason I doubt those guys sustained velocity into the mid 90s while doing so. I do not believe it possible for a human being to pitch 300 innings while sitting at 95+. That's not to say they weren't good, the great pitchers back then had great walk rates and had good pitch mixes and threw more breaking stuff, etc. I just can't buy that your average fastball in the 1930s wasn't at least 4-5 mph slower than the average fastball today, when the average fastball right now is a good 1-2 mph faster than it was as recently as 2008.

Watch the film.  When you see who the fastest pitcher ever is, your jaw will drop!

I'm getting closer to Yeti:Fastball::Pank:Die Hard each time you write that.

McClane kills Gruber.

Nolan Ryan -- 108.5 mph.

Goddamnit, CD.

McClane kills Gruber?

[Quality Start Machine]

I have made this reference before, "Spahn and Sain and pray for rain".  For you young'uns it refers to Boston's Warren Spahn and Johnny Sain, and the fact that they didn't have a legitimate number three for a three man pitching rotation.  Great pitchers were a different breed back then.  That is not saying that they were better than today's pitchers, but that the great ones of earlier eras would be great today.  I am not going to do the research, but my sense is that they started more games and pitched longer into games than pitchers are expected today.

This is an undeniable fact, which is the main reason I doubt those guys sustained velocity into the mid 90s while doing so. I do not believe it possible for a human being to pitch 300 innings while sitting at 95+. That's not to say they weren't good, the great pitchers back then had great walk rates and had good pitch mixes and threw more breaking stuff, etc. I just can't buy that your average fastball in the 1930s wasn't at least 4-5 mph slower than the average fastball today, when the average fastball right now is a good 1-2 mph faster than it was as recently as 2008.

Nobody ever claimed these guys were sitting at 95. In fact, I think a lot of them took pride in "pitching smart" -- not exerting themselves particularly hard against the dregs of the lineup. And in many of the eras past, there were a lot of dead spots in the lineup.

I'm not saying they threw harder than Aroldis Chapman, but I wouldn't be shocked if they could get pretty close for one pitch.

Plus, up until Ted Williams - and it took a long time for everyone else to catch up - the idea was that hitters needed heavier bats. Williams was the (white) innovator when it came to lighter bats=more bat speed=more power. Shit, Hank Sauer won the 1952 MVP swinging a 36 inch, 40 ounce hunk of lumber. So not every pitch needed to leave a vapor trail.

[CT III]

I have made this reference before, "Spahn and Sain and pray for rain".  For you young'uns it refers to Boston's Warren Spahn and Johnny Sain, and the fact that they didn't have a legitimate number three for a three man pitching rotation.  Great pitchers were a different breed back then.  That is not saying that they were better than today's pitchers, but that the great ones of earlier eras would be great today.  I am not going to do the research, but my sense is that they started more games and pitched longer into games than pitchers are expected today.

This is an undeniable fact, which is the main reason I doubt those guys sustained velocity into the mid 90s while doing so. I do not believe it possible for a human being to pitch 300 innings while sitting at 95+. That's not to say they weren't good, the great pitchers back then had great walk rates and had good pitch mixes and threw more breaking stuff, etc. I just can't buy that your average fastball in the 1930s wasn't at least 4-5 mph slower than the average fastball today, when the average fastball right now is a good 1-2 mph faster than it was as recently as 2008.

Watch the film.  When you see who the fastest pitcher ever is, your jaw will drop!

I'm getting closer to Yeti:Fastball::Pank:Die Hard each time you write that.

McClane kills Gruber.

Nolan Ryan -- 108.5 mph.

Goddamnit, CD.

McClane kills Gruber?

Technically that spoils two Die Hard movies.

[CBStew]

I have made this reference before, "Spahn and Sain and pray for rain".  For you young'uns it refers to Boston's Warren Spahn and Johnny Sain, and the fact that they didn't have a legitimate number three for a three man pitching rotation.  Great pitchers were a different breed back then.  That is not saying that they were better than today's pitchers, but that the great ones of earlier eras would be great today.  I am not going to do the research, but my sense is that they started more games and pitched longer into games than pitchers are expected today.

This is an undeniable fact, which is the main reason I doubt those guys sustained velocity into the mid 90s while doing so. I do not believe it possible for a human being to pitch 300 innings while sitting at 95+. That's not to say they weren't good, the great pitchers back then had great walk rates and had good pitch mixes and threw more breaking stuff, etc. I just can't buy that your average fastball in the 1930s wasn't at least 4-5 mph slower than the average fastball today, when the average fastball right now is a good 1-2 mph faster than it was as recently as 2008.

Nobody ever claimed these guys were sitting at 95. In fact, I think a lot of them took pride in "pitching smart" -- not exerting themselves particularly hard against the dregs of the lineup. And in many of the eras past, there were a lot of dead spots in the lineup.

I'm not saying they threw harder than Aroldis Chapman, but I wouldn't be shocked if they could get pretty close for one pitch.

Plus, up until Ted Williams - and it took a long time for everyone else to catch up - the idea was that hitters needed heavier bats. Williams was the (white) innovator when it came to lighter bats=more bat speed=more power. Shit, Hank Sauer won the 1952 MVP swinging a 36 inch, 40 ounce hunk of lumber. So not every pitch needed to leave a vapor trail.

I watched a film of Ty Cobb on YouTube.  He swung a blunderbuss bat.

[Quality Start Machine]

Watched this, positive it strenuously. I found the anecdotal stuff about Steve Dalkowski fascinating.

In all the footage though, the one pitch that made me say "holy shit!" was Sandy Koufax's curveball.